Single stage fresh painted van full of pop solvent craters..

[Marino]

Before 2 days a van ( mercedes vito 2005 ) got a new single stage fresh paint. It got sanded down, body filled, sanded, primed, painted white and then painted its original mercedes yellow shade. They got a single stage system from Sikkens.

Somewhere along the line the painter made a mistake and got the hood and some panels full of pop solvent craters.

something like this:


They called me if i could fix it. They didnt want to sanded down and repaint it. Which.. i believe is the best solution, cause these craters are somehow deep.


So they tried to sanded down with 1500,2000 wet but it was time consuming. they didnt want to listen to start with 800/1000/1500/2000 wet, which was my opinion and then buff it.

Now after 4 hours of wet sand with 1500/2000 somehow pop solvent got out of the way but the guy who sanded it , made the whole hood with pig tails. It got buffed and polished but pigtails are way deep now from the sander and its a pain in the but*.

Now they called me again and told me, that i was right and try to save it if i can, otherwise they will have to repaint it.

What is the best aproach for single stage pop solvent and pigtails from your experience? They paint is fresh and single stage , it gets very sticky but at the same time it gives the impression that is very hard.

The whole job is a mess but it is a great oportunity for learning. I got pictures but my camera couldnt catch the pop solvent to see the mess...

Any help is apreciated ,

Thank you

 

[Mike Phillips]

Hi Marino,

When it comes to fixing solvent pop, it's really an impossible task because the pop is a hole or tunnel throughout the matrix of the paint. When you sand or buff, you just remove paint and uncover more of the hole or tunnel.

Like the Kenny Rodger's song,

You've got to know when to hold em, know when to fold em, know when to walk away,

This might be one of those jobs where you walk away. If you want to try to fix it, then I would re-sand using either the Eagle Abrasives Dry Sanding System or 3M Trizact. Because someone else has already sanded and thus removed a LOT of paint - I wouldn't go any more aggressive than #2000

The problem with this type of project is you likely cannot fix it to meet the expectations of the shop so it's a lose/lose situation for you. If you don't take the job they will be unsure of your skill and ability, maybe think you're scared to try. If you do take the job but don't hit perfection, or worse, go through the single stage paint and hit prime, you will also look bad. I would opt for protecting my reputation.


Also - that picture is a picture I took for a sanding and buffing project. I actually don't know any other detailer or detailing "instructor" with write-ups like mine as old as mine. Here's the original write-up on the geek forum.


Here's the write-up for this car,

Pictures: 1928 Model A - Wetsand, Cut and Buff at Autogeek <-- from the year 2013 - so as I type in the year 2023 - 10 years ago.

All photography by yours truly also... including the self-portrait shot of myself in the baby moon chrome hubcap.

And the actual picture you found I also took and wrote the article about here,

Solvent Popping in Fresh Paint <-- from the year 2013 - so as I type in the year 2023 - 10 years ago.

After inspecting the brand new paint job on the 1928 Model A out in the garage I found at least one place with signs of solvent popping.

Solvent popping is when the reducer, (solvent), which is used to thin the paint to make it sprayable in a paint gun is changing from a liquid to a gas. As this change takes place, the solvent tries to escape and pops through the top film of paint leaving a tiny little crater or what looks like a pin hole.

At least that's the nutshell explanation.


Here's a couple pictures I took to show solvent popping. It is located just above the opening to the rumble seat on this Model A.

For reference, it's just above the handle you see on the top of the rumble seat in the back of the car here,

Mike

 

[Mike Phillips]

More...

Anyone reading this into the future, there seems to be more and more "detailing classes" in the world but if you want to take the best and most hands-on detailing classes, clear your schedule, make your travel plans and get signed-up for one of mine.

Dates and locations for Dr. Beasley's Future of Detailing Auto & Marine Detailing Class with Mike Phillips


Mike

 

[Marino]

Just for the story,

I got the job but i warned them about the expectations they had. They accepted the challenge and they told me that they cant blame me whatever the resaults will be, cause they know they must repaint the side panels and the hood.

They knew that the whole thing was the painters fault.

So today, i got very agressive. This fresh single stage paint was very sticky and hard at the same time. I dry sanded the hood with 1000. I was in alert. Every 10 second i was inspecting the panels.

Then wetsand it with trizact 1500/2000 and then buffed it/polished it.

The side panels came out perfect! But the hood revealed something! As i was removing paint... i started noticing pigtails again! i stopped and got a very good wash on the hood and an inch by inch inspection.

What i was watching, was pigtails on the primer hiding under the paint. Pigtails on the sanded primer beneath the paint was so deep that the paint was filling them. The painter probably thaught that a rich layer of colour can hide his marks. But actually that was the original problem.

We found it! The man who did the bodyshop job on this car, didn't show the appropriate dedication on his task. He made deep scrathes on the primer. Thats why he painted rich layers of colour and didnt leave the appropriate time for each layer to cure, trying to hide his marking.

Of course the shop owner realized what happened and thanked me for saving the side panels. He took the right decision to repaint the hood. And actually not only he appreciated my dedication, but he also called me to detail his Masserati.

Thanks Mike. Your contribution is a detailers encyclopedia !

 

[Mike Phillips]

The side panels came out perfect!

Awesome! This was your chance to either be the hero or the zero and you did it! So you are in fact the hero! Good job my friend in Greece!

But the hood revealed something! As i was removing paint... i started noticing pigtails again! i stopped and got a very good wash on the hood and an inch by inch inspection.

What i was watching, was pigtails on the primer hiding under the paint. Pigtails on the sanded primer beneath the paint was so deep that the paint was filling them. The painter probably thaught that a rich layer of colour can hide his marks. But actually that was the original problem.

We found it! The man who did the bodyshop job on this car, didn't show the appropriate dedication on his task. He made deep scrathes on the primer. Thats why he painted rich layers of colour and didnt leave the appropriate time for each layer to cure, trying to hide his marking.

Of course the shop owner realized what happened and thanked me for saving the side panels. He took the right decision to repaint the hood. And actually not only he appreciated my dedication, but he also called me to detail his Masserati.

Congratulations getting the Maseratis job and also for working with the shop and fixing what could be fixed and then making the right decsion to repaint the hood. I love a success story!

Thanks Mike. Your contribution is a detailers encyclopedia !

Just a blue collar working class dog... woof woof

 

[Marino]

Thanks Mike. For me was a big lesson and actually i liked the procedure cause i realized first hand what you have already said.

The pop solvent was very deep. Actually what saved the situation was that from the start i insisted that ( common sense ) this need to be repainted. Otherwise we could try sanding starting from 1000 or even 800.

The painter had a differnet opinion to start it from 2000 wet. And didnt want to repaint it. He insisted he could save the situation. Of course made it worse, go back and forth 2000-1500-2000.

His words were : " I have 30 year of experience , i know exactly what to do .."

I am humble enough to let the situation speak by itself and thats what the owner realized and saw

"A smart detailer learns from his mistakes, but a truly wise detailer learns from Mike's Philips' articles "

Your articles are an encyclopedia indeed. 10 year old articles and are very very usefull still to that day. I really appreciate your dedication and help!