Question about conventional car washes?

[Mike Lambert]

Ivan Lacroix who I’m sure you know, says using a car shampoo is old technology that he feels should not be used. It supposedly leaves a dim masking the surface appearance. Rather it should be replaced with a rinseless wash. Your opinion?

 

[Mike Lambert]

Leaves a film

 

[Mike Phillips]

Depends on the LSP on the car.

 

[2black1s]

And the Shampoo... Some rinse cleaner than others.

 

[Maui]

Ivan Lacroix who I’m sure you know, says using a car shampoo is old technology that he feels should not be used. It supposedly leaves a dim masking the surface appearance. Rather it should be replaced with a rinseless wash. Your opinion?

Use a shampoo that leaves nothing behind. In that way you are not masking the LSP.

 

[Mike Phillips]

Just to chime in...

When Mike Lambert originally posted his question I was on my phone. I don't like to type on my phone. Now I'm behind a full size keyboard.


Here's the deal when it comes to car washes. Like I originally stated, what type of car wash is "good or bad" depends on the LSP or Last Step Product on the paint.

My guess, (and I hate guessing or assuming), is the context of what Mike Lambert is asking about is car washes for ceramic coated paint.

If this is correct, then my take is the type of car wash you want to use is a straight, dedicated cleaning only car wash. You simply want to clean any dirt and road grime off the paint finish and leave NOTHING behind on the surface.

Why?

Because if you use a car wash that also contains a wax product, or some other glossing or shine ingredients, then what you're doing is putting something ON the coating and thus getting the benefits and features of the ingredients or substance being left on the paint INSTEAD of the benefits and features of the actual paint coating.

The "issue" with this is, in most cases the reason you installed a paint coating or PAID to have a paint coating installed on your car is to get the benefits and features of the coating. Using a car wash that leaves something behind defeats the original purpose or choice of LSP.

Make sense?



The exceptions would be...


SiO2 Car Washes
There are some car wash options that claim to leave behind SiO2 or some other form of "nano size particles" of protection or water beading ingredients that in theory compliment the coating on your car. I've used a number of these and actually like as they do seem to work.

My concern is if you always use this type of product you'll get a build-up of the magic voodoo ingredients and this could be a negative, not a positive result over time. I think a better idea would be to interchange car washes. One time use a dedicated simple car wash that only cleans, the next time use the enhanced booster wash, then go back to the simple wash. In theory, this would prevent any type of build-up.



Wax-Enhanced Car Washes
If you use a conventional car wax, for example a Carnauba Car Wax, (of some other form of "wax" based ingredient). Or if you use some type of synthetic paint sealant to protect your car's paint - then using some brand of car wash that somehow magically leaves behind some kind of wax or synthetic protection ingredients can be a good thing if it actually works and maintains or enhances gloss, shine, water beading and/or protection.



It kind of goes to what I've been saying in the car detailing world for decades,


"Find something you like and use it often"


At the end of the day, if you're happy... that's what's most important when it comes to keeping your car clean an shiny.

 

[Jacob Harrod AutoClean]

If you want to use rinseless washes, I use the Wolfgang SiO2 Rinseless wash. I believe as Mike stated this would be a great booster wash for coated vehicles, and just to add to what Mike said if you need a foaming waterless wash that just cleans in between your SIO2 washes you could use Ammo Frothe as a waterless wash.

You can also use ammo Frothe as a pre wash foam before rinsing off the car and doing your rinseless wash.

Once I rinse off a car I have to get it inside as quickly as possible to prevent water spots, as I can't wash inside, and I don't have a wash bay. So I do a regular cleaning of the wheels tires and wheel wells, then rinse the car off and pull it inside for the rinseless wash.

If I could get away with it I would do traditional washes with a multi towel or multi wash mitt process, as I feel like the traditional wash process gets the car cleaner, and it seems a little more simple to me.

 

[Mike Lambert]

Ivan feels that soap of any kind is old school, I haven’t been swayed that way yet. I do wet the car down with a rinseless wash before my pre rinse. I use a zero bucket method to wash and find its easier and faster for me. But as has been said, whatever method makes you happy!

 

[Jayfro]

What would be a good soap/shampoo that would add nothing that you would recommend?

Currently my Acura is Wax based and my wife's X3 is Graphene (303) with a Wax on top of it (single layer)....AG shipped the wrong product for my car but shipped DoDo Diamond White Wax "designed" for white cars....darn the bad luck!

I plan on using DP Graphene Soap for her car and I use DoDo Sour Power for my car which has tons and I mean tons of gloss enhancing "stuff" in it!

Thank you,
JF

 

[Mike Phillips]

Ivan feels that soap of any kind is old school, I haven’t been swayed that way yet. I do wet the car down with a rinseless wash before my pre rinse. I use a zero bucket method to wash and find its easier and faster for me. But as has been said, whatever method makes you happy!

I have to politely disagree. I prefer to wash a car using running water as long as it's not an SIV or Special Interest Vehicle, where as a professional courtesy to the owner I don't introduce running water to places where it can cause or accelerate rust.

The KEY is using the correct car wash for the intended purpose.

A rinseless wash is a "version" of a regular wash and the same thing goes, that is use the correct "type" of rinseless wash for the type of car and or type of work you're doing.

There's a HUGE difference between a Prep Wash and a Maintenance Wash.

 

[Dr Oldz]

Washing a car is the basis of detailing. No matter how you look at it, it’s the corner stone of our industry. Put is as a “must”before we can do anything else.

My first option is always with a hose and plenty of free flowing water. Most vehicles fall under this category as they are made to get wet. You approach is up to you…. 1 bucket thru 59 bucket method is fine.

Personally I only use the one bucket method and have for years. Yes I use a separate bucket and wash media for the wheels. But I only use one bucket for washing paint. I just simply rinse my mitt, sponge, or whatever media I choose out with the hose before I reintroduced it to the “soap” bucket.
This is the safest method In my opinion to wash a vehicle. Water restrictions do not always allow this unfortunately.

I’m still not a fan of rinseless or waterless washes unless it is a special interest vehicle that may not be able to handle a bunch of free flowing water being poured over it due to compromised seals or rust issues. Both these methods do not flush away heavy contamination which is the leading cause of swirls. While some have really perfected their methods of these style washes, no one has proven to me that they are safer when both options are available.

As far as what I use to wash a vehicle, I primarily use two shampoos.

1) Optimum car wash. It does the three things I need out of a car shampoo a) cleans well b) rinses super easy 3) provide great lubrication…. bonus) smells nice… while not an important factor, washing a car should be fun and it makes it fun. To add: I haven’t had any issues with gloss enhancers or whatnot building up over repeat use.

2) Wolfgang uber SIO2 wash. This is a great booster product that does NOT need to be used every wash. I use it on a well maintained vehicle every 3rd or 4th wash as it really adds protection.

I have learned to stay away from typical wash and wax shampoos as I have seen a lot of them building up on windshields and creating smearing/vision issues.

I have been professionally detailing for many years and this is just my experience and personal methods. You use what works best for you as you see fit!!! End of the day we want clean shiny rides!!!

 

[opie]

Washing a car is the basis of detailing. No matter how you look at it, it’s the corner stone of our industry. Put is as a “must”before we can do anything else.

My first option is always with a hose and plenty of free flowing water. Most vehicles fall under this category as they are made to get wet. You approach is up to you…. 1 bucket thru 59 bucket method is fine.

Personally I only use the one bucket method and have for years. Yes I use a separate bucket and wash media for the wheels. But I only use one bucket for washing paint. I just simply rinse my mitt, sponge, or whatever media I choose out with the hose before I reintroduced it to the “soap” bucket.
This is the safest method In my opinion to wash a vehicle. Water restrictions do not always allow this unfortunately.

I’m still not a fan of rinseless or waterless washes unless it is a special interest vehicle that may not be able to handle a bunch of free flowing water being poured over it due to compromised seals or rust issues. Both these methods do not flush away heavy contamination which is the leading cause of swirls. While some have really perfected their methods of these style washes, no one has proven to me that they are safer when both options are available.

As far as what I use to wash a vehicle, I primarily use two shampoos.

1) Optimum car wash. It does the three things I need out of a car shampoo a) cleans well b) rinses super easy 3) provide great lubrication…. bonus) smells nice… while not an important factor, washing a car should be fun and it makes it fun. To add: I haven’t had any issues with gloss enhancers or whatnot building up over repeat use.

2) Wolfgang uber SIO2 wash. This is a great booster product that does NOT need to be used every wash. I use it on a well maintained vehicle every 3rd or 4th wash as it really adds protection.

I have learned to stay away from typical wash and wax shampoos as I have seen a lot of them building up on windshields and creating smearing/vision issues.

I have been professionally detailing for many years and this is just my experience and personal methods. You use what works best for you as you see fit!!! End of the day we want clean shiny rides!!!

My wash method is just the same as you have described, i do use a grit guard in my paint and wheel buckets as well.

I cannot bring myself to use rinseless or waterless. I do not have or detail any SIV, so theres no reason not to use water.

Try implementing a rinseless or waterless wash way of thinking next time you take a shower. Ask yourself afterwards if you are just as clean as you would be with a normal shower.

 

[Don M]

My thinking is along the lines of Jim and Opie, especially since I have a heavily driven BLACK car that's highly polished. I drive an average of 600 miles a week and in that time, it gathers a lot of debris on the paint (road film, bugs, dust and dirt), way too much to consider a waterless or rinseless wash IMO. I feel much better with an initial heavy rinse to flush the majority of the loose debris off before ever touching the car with a soapy mitt.

Like Mike says: "Black is a full-time job." So why make the job harder by risking swirls and scratches if they can be (mostly) avoided by a full water wash? Now if I had a garage queen or a show car, one that's rarely driven, I would likely consider a waterless/rinseless wash.

 

[Mike Phillips]

For the record, my preference for washing is always running water, as in a water hose and bucket approach. I only use the waterless or rinseless wash option when it's either the only option or the right thing to do for the car.

Recently Jim Lafeber, after attending a number of my 3-day car detailing classes, introduced a brand new product for a brand new category of products.

The category is Prep Wash and the product is referred to by the same name - Prep Wash


I've only had a chance to use the first version and since then he has tweaked the formula and improved it. The original formula seem to just fine so I can only guess the latest version works even better.

I'll take credit for being the creator of this category of products for the detailing industry as well as the name of the new category. My guess is moving forward other companies will copy this product and introduce their own versions.

 

[Don M]

How about some details on this Prep Wash? OCD minds want to know Or better yet. a write up?

 

[Mike Phillips]

How about some details on this Prep Wash? OCD minds want to know Or better yet. a write up?

Tons of info and a video here.

I was flattered someone paid attention to what I was doing in my classes and sharing in the online world. Jim is very astute.

 

[Jayfro]

Wolfgang SiO2 wash is an outstanding product, I bought it when MP recommended it...I’m out right now but I do plan on buying another bottle as soon as I recover from buying everything for our daughter going to college.:.wow! I’ll also probably pickup some optimum as I’ve heard great things about it.

 

[Mike Lambert]

Again, whatever makes you happy, I’ll refer you all to Final Inspection Auto Boutique in Australia. A couple interesting videos on washing and why no buckets or foam.